CWU LIVING HISTORY PROJECT

SHIRLEY KERN

Lowther: Today we are interviewing Shirley Kern who was a student at Central. Larry Lowther is the interviewer and Jean Putnam is operating the equipment. Shirley, before we get into your Central career, would you tell us a little bit about yourself. Where you were born and brought up and something about your family background and your early education?

Kern: I was born in actually what is now Union Gap and lived in Yakima until I was about five and then we moved to the other side and then to Okanogan and I went to school in Okanogan when I was in first grade. I graduated from Okanogan High School and then came here after that. My mother had graduated from Central. Of course at that time it was a Normal School and also my aunt had graduated from Central - from the Normal School. I grew up on a sheep and cattle ranch and swore I would never marry a rancher which is what I did. (laughs) Then when I came to Central - that was after I graduated as valedictorian from Okanogan High School - had four - three sisters and two of them came here, one for two years and one for one year and then graduated - and then the others graduated from Pullman. I had to graduate from Central because I had to get my degree before Phil and I were married.

Lowther: So you were here from 1941 to 1945?

Kern: To the spring of 1945.

Lowther: And what sort of program did you take? What was your major area?

Kern: My major area was P.E. and then I went ahead and ended up with three minors. It was good. Jess Pucket was - and Miss Horn –

Lowther: Were you planning to be a teacher?

Kern: Yes, in fact I was going to be a therapist - a physical therapist and go back to the University of Wisconsin and then because of the war why we decided to get married and gave that up and graduated with a teaching degree and my minors were health, P.E., and home ec. So that was the way that came about.

Lowther: Do they - was it a bachelor of education?

Kern: It was. Right.

Lowther: Can you tell us a little bit about your living arrangements while you were going to school. Did you live on campus?

Kern: I lived on campus. I lived in Sue Lombard. The first year I lived with a very nice person named June Bailey, who has since gone and then I lived with two girls and we went the rest of the way through except when they - we were there as sophomores and juniors and Helen Hines went in the WAVES and Mary Roswell left to get married and then the last year I roomed with Barbara Howard and we were living over the dorm over the infirmary which was a wonderful place to live. It was easy to live there. We lived all by ourselves and Betty McCormick was, of course, the nurse at that time and she was a good friend.

Putnam: Where was the infirmary?

Kern: It was on the - it would be the north - it would be the east side - northeast side of Sue.

Lowther: You didn’t live off campus at all, right?

Kern: I never lived off campus.

Lowther: Can you tell us a little bit about the social life of people who lived in dorms?

Kern: Well there was a lot of after hours chatting and talking and parties - room parties and getting together and that kind of thing. Depends, of course, on how much studying you have and how important it is to you. The time of year makes a difference, of course. We had Wednesday night - do you want just in the dorm?

Lowther: Well, not necessarily in the dorm. I was thinking in terms of students living an campus. So, recreation, entertainment, the social life that they had.

Kern: We had dances, of course, that the different dormitories gave. Formal dances a lot of them. We had, let’s see, Wednesday night dances in the first floor of Barge here until the cadets came and then of course that room was taken up with their activities and then there was the USC in the old Y building when the cadets were here and they had dances there for everybody who wanted to go. We had rallies - pep rallies. For homecoming week we had stunts and skits and floats and all that sort of thing that would - it seemed to keep everybody busy. You could be on as many committees as you wanted to be or that you thought you could be.

Lowther: Now, you mentioned the cadets. Did the war really impact campus very much?

Kern: It impacted the campus a lot. Really, because our fellows all left. Forty- two - 1942 was really a pretty normal year. We had a lot of social activities. We had a lot of sports that the boys were all doing football, basketball, track, all those things. The girls were doing the same thing. We didn’t have - we just had a lot of fun that year. Then they were leaving for the various services and it just really got to be to the point where we just had 4F fellows and they weren’t happy to be here. Then the cadets came which was a lot more interesting.

Lowther: When did the cadets come?

Kern: They came about ‘43.

Lowther: Were these Air Force cadets?

Kern: These were Air Force cadets.

Lowther: Was there much social activity between the girls on campus and the cadets.

Kern: Yes, in fact one of my roommates met a fellow and married him and he was an engineer at White Sands after the war and they?. I did not participate. Phil and I were already involved. (laughs)

Lowther: Do you have any memory of meals on campus?

Kern: Some were good and some were bad. (laughs) I don’t think we had the variety. We certainly wouldn’t have anything like Taco Time and that sort of thing.

Lowther: How about the cost of education. How did you finance it? What - did you consider it expensive at the time?

Kern: It was expensive at the time because you see we were just recovering from the depression too, my family. We had a ranch so we didn’t have any problem with food or anything like that but the price of sheep and cattle wasn’t real good. So we all worked in the summertime. My sister - I have three sisters and we would contract with orchards and thin which I didn’t like but it was very good money. Then the last summer between my junior and senior year I boxed apple boxes for the machines and the last day I can’t remember how many I made but it was a real record and I was so pleased to be done.

Lowther: That was back in Okanogan?

Kern: That was in Okanogan. My dad would match whatever we made during the summer. And then now and then we had to find a steer that would help take care of what we needed extra too. He would find - in other words we would have steers that he would simply sell for us.

Lowther: You don’t recall what tuition was?

Kern: I can’t recall what tuition was and I talked to –

Lowther: Or what it cost to live in the dorms?

Kern: No, I’m sorry, I can’t. I talked to several friends and they don’t remember either. My sister had a $150 scholarship she said and she thought it paid for tuition for the year but we couldn’t be sure.

Lowther: You didn’t have to work part time while going to school?

Kern: I did not work part time - no, while I was going to school.

Lowther: And you didn’t have a scholarship assistance?

Kern: I did have a Reader’s Digest Music Scholarship. I took lessons from Juanita Davies for a year.

Lowther: You were also a musician then?

Kern: Well I tried to be.

Lowther: Did you sing or play an instrument?

Kern: I did both. I played the piano and I did sing some but not enough to –

Lowther: Did you take part in any of the musical groups?

Kern: No I did not after high school.

Lowther: Okay, do you recall any of your professors? Do any of them stand out?

Kern: I have some real special ones. Like Helen Michaelsen and Ray Shaw and Ken Courson was, of course, an administrator but he was a real special person too. They were all good friends but those two were most helpful when I needed help on student government and that sort of thing because I had become involved with that and I would have a lot of problems, I thought, being very conscientious. What am I going to do? So they were really just wonderful. I could go and see them any time.

Lowther: You were sort of majoring in P.E. and health. How did your paths cross with Michaelsen and –

Kern: I don’t remember why that was so - they just seemed to be more interested perhaps in student government than some of the others.

Lowther: I see. So you were involved in student government?

Kern: I was very involved in that.

Lowther: What offices did you hold?

Kern: Well, I was secretary and then at that time we were - it was the new student government association and it had been written in and put in, of course, on the campus and it was sort of like a - well the administration wondering if this was going to work. We sort of had to prove ourselves.

Lowther: There hadn’t been a student government before then?

Kern: No, not this kind. And we got an Honor Council which would take care of most of the disciplinary problems for the students.

Lowther: What was the function of student government?

Kern: To take care of activities. Plan activities on campus. Take care of the students whatever they needed to do. I always seemed to be awfully busy.

Lowther: Did a lot of students seem interested in student government or were they apathetic?

Kern: I think there’s always a certain group that is interested in student government and the others just don’t care. It isn’t interesting for them.

Lowther: Did it take much of your time?

Kern: I took a lot of time. It really did.

Lowther: Do you feel that it affected the quality of work that you did for your classes?

Kern: No, I don’t really because I seemed to get that done too. I stayed up long nights.

Lowther: You must have been a pretty disciplined person?

Kern: I was, I made a lot of lists. In fact, I can teach about lists.

Lowther: Were - what’s your impression about the students at that time? Were they a pretty serious bunch?

Kern: They were pretty serious, you know, because that was war time. Everybody was very involved and as I said, one of my roommates, Helen Hines, at that time and now she’s Helen Hines-Fitzgerald left to join the WAVES. Several of the other girls left to go into wartime - like Bremerton - going to Bremerton to work over there or whatever had to be done. The fellows all - most of the fellows left. There just seemed to be - it was a different attitude I think.

Lowther: Did many of you, while you were going to school, did many of you participate in activities that contributed to the war effort like bond drives?

Kern: I think we did. But that wasn’t a very big item. We could if we wanted to and tried to.

Lowther: Were there other extra-curricular activities that you took part in besides the student government?

Kern: Like the Women’s Association?

Lowther: Well, tell me about it.

Kern: Well this was the Associated Women’s association which prepared the activities for the women, of course. Each group seemed to have certain activities that they would plan whether it would be a snow ball or - I’ve forgotten the rest of the things. The Colonial Ball and those things. Those were the parties and they would have teas, alumni teas in Sue Lombard and these things but –

Lowther: Alumni teas?

Kern: Alumni teas.

Lowther: What were they?

Kern: Frankly, I can’t remember other than (laughs)

Lowther: Are we talking about around Homecoming when alumni would come?

Kern: Yes, right.

Lowther: Did you take part in any sports? I know that you were –

Kern: I was in P.E. majors and minors club and I was president of that one year and in Iokians - was an honorary sophomore women’s service group and the - let me think which was Dr. Shaw’s?

Lowther: Did you play basketball?

Kern: I played intramural sports.

Lowther: Interscholastic?

Kern: Interscholastic.

Putnam: Which -what sports were they then?

Kern: We had basketball, volleyball. We had tennis. I did not take golf?

Lowther: Did you have swimming at that time?

Kern: No.

Putnam: Did they have hockey? Field hockey then?

Kern: I can’t remember.

Lowther: Other students - are there certain students that stand out in your memory as being particularly active, excellent, accomplishing a lot or who succeeded later in life?

Kern: I think all of the students that I particularly remember would have been people that were close to me. Of course, Roy Wahle, Ray Jongeward, Henry Hambler and Barb Howard, ? now. Barb Howard succeeded me as president and then Maxine McCormick ? succeeded Barb and Barb and I were real close. Bobby Lynn was another good friend. Helen Hines and I had a very good friend whose name was Cathleen Prior who got me through physics or I would never have gotten that taken care cit. I was taking kinesiology and those things and Barbara Carson and Helen and Russ Wiseman too were very active on campus. But there are a lot of people that I could name but its hard to choose.

Lowther: What is - excuse me, go ahead.

Kern: I’m sorry. It’s just hard to choose a few.

Lowther: At that time, do you recall whether there were many married students?

Kern: There weren’t many married students.

Lowther: How about what we now call the non-traditional students? The student who has been out in a career and has come back somewhat older.

Kern: I had to go through the Hyakems in order to refresh my memory on some of these things and I think I found probably one or two women that were married that were older and I think that’s about the extent of it in the four years I was here.

Lowther: So most of the student body would probably fall between the ages of 18

and 22?

Kern: Yes, yes.

Lowther: Where was the library located at that time?

Kern: The library at that time was the building just west of Barge.

Lowther: Okay, that would be Shaw-Smyser. Did you make much use of the library?

Kern: Yes, I did. Margaret and I used the library, a good friend.

Lowther: Did you feel that it was well stocked?

Kern: It was for what I needed for all of the things I had to do research papers on.

Lowther: You don’t happen to recall how large the library was or the number of

staff?

Kern: No, I don’t.

Lowther: Now, how about the various parts of the - what you might call the supporting parts of the college? Registration, registrar’s office? Do you remember anything about procedure?

Kern: It was very simple as I remember. We just came and signed up for the classes that we needed. I don’t remember any great - I don’t know, we may have been downstairs - we signed up downstairs but there wasn’t certainly the procedure that there is.

Lowther: It was very simple?

Kern: it was very simple. There were only I think in the Who’s Who for 1943 and ‘44 in the universities and colleges. It says we only had 261 students, so you see we were very small.

Lowther: Two hundred and sixty-one? Did you have many dealings with the business office or the custodial staff?

Kern: No dealings with the custodial staff. Dealings with Ken Courson, of course, in the business office and he was always very great to talk to or discuss things with. They were very friendly. Dr. Sam was very friendly. Well you probably know Lilian Gregory-Jongeward now and she was his secretary for several years and she was a good friend. That was the attitude they would take. It was a very friendly administration.

Lowther: You felt comfortable?

Kern: Yes, very comfortable.

Lowther: Was there a student health center?

Kern: That was in the infirmary directly below our room.

Lowther: Okay, I think you had mentioned the infirmary. Did you have occasion to use it?

Kern: No, my sister did. She and her roommate got, I don’t remember - measles or scarlet fever but they were there.

Lowther: Was there a doctor on duty or a nurse?

Kern: They could call the doctor. Betty McCormick was a qualified nurse - registered nurse and Helen, I think her name was Hansen, was the other registered nurse and they would call the doctors if they were needed.

Lowther: Did you receive any awards or honors while attending Central?

Kern: Well, for instance, like being in Who’s Who?

Lowther: Yeah.

Kern: For three years. Let’s see - I did write some of this down and then I was president or secretary of the SGA and the Colonial Ball princess and then something we did that was fun was there was a conference in Reno, and at that time, of course, traveling was a little difficult but as SGA president I met Catherine Woods - Hayley now and we traveled to Reno for this meeting on student government training to take care of the various affairs and that sort of thing and at that time then Wilfred Woods who was Kay’s brother and he is now the editor and publisher of the Wenatchee World and he was in the army in San Francisco so he came to meet us and we had a weekend which was fun. That was one of the pluses.

Lowther: Did you for example graduate with honors?

Kern: I don’t remember. I’ll have to tell you how I graduated? Phil got his commission. Phil Kern came here then at the beginning of his sophomore year ? and then he was in the V12 and - the Marine Corps and they were drafted and called into action and they went to the U and went to school there ? and this sort of thing they did went straight through and he graduated then and left in the summer of ‘43 and went back to Parris Island and then ? River and then graduated in Quantico with his Second Lieutenant honors. Came back and he graduated - he had his bars about a month before school was out here which was my last quarter on campus. So we were married. Had five days of honeymoon and then came back and I did five days of projects and all those things, you know, that these nice people, these professors had said, ‘Yes you may get out of school a month early if you do these things.’ So I was lucky to get out of school.

Lowther: There were a lot of adjustments at that time made.

Kern: There were a lot of adjustments, right, that was pretty special for them to do that.

Lowther: Sounds as though your husband was in the Navy Air?

Kern: He was in the Marine Corps. He was at both bases and Pendleton after we were married and ? after that.

Lowther: I’m going to run down a list of things and if any of them ring a bell then respond. Women’s rights?

Kern: That was not really - we had Rosy the Riveter, of course, you know, with women taking the men’s jobs but that wasn’t a big issue at that time as far - at least as far as we were concerned. We just did our thing.

Lowther: How did most women project their futures?

Kern: Well, most of them projected the future as far as getting married. They wanted - they wanted some way to also be able to take care of themselves.

Lowther: Did they see their college education as a kind of insurance policy in case they needed to go to work or were they planning to combine career and marriage?

Kern: Oh, I think more - I can’t really give you a good answer on that. I know what I felt. I had to be able to take care of myself as a safeguard.

Lowther: Did you go into teaching?

Kern: No I did not. I did not. We were married and then we had our first child and then four girls after that so –

Lowther: You were pretty busy.

Kern: I was very busy.

Lowther: Okay, sexual or racial discrimination?

Kern: I don’t remember that we had much of that either or anything. We had no racial discrimination because we just had never –

Lowther: There were no blacks students?

Kern: There were no black students.

Lowther: Were there any other ethnic minorities?

Kern: Yes, we had a couple of Aleutian Indians and they fit in and we had probably one or two from the Yakima Nation but there was no particular discrimination.

Lowther: Do you think there would have been if there had been blacks on campus? Do you have any idea as to attitudes?

Kern: I have no idea because that was just something that wasn’t - I know there were blacks in Ellensburg at that time - the families and they seemed to be accepted and the kids were little and went through high school.

Lowther: Okay, smoking, drinking, narcotics? Were these problems?

Kern: Always beer around and smoking, of course, was discouraged in the rooms They had to smoke in rooms. If you wanted to you smoked in your room and then aired the room out but there was drinking. We had no narcotics, at least that I know of or knew of then.

Lowther: Did the school have the reputation of being a party school?

Kern: No.

Lowther: Okay.

Kern: There were parties, of course, there were parties.

Lowther: Okay, academic freedom?

Kern: I was trying to give you an answer for that when I went through these questions and I don’t think we had any particular –

Lowther: That would probably apply more to professors than to students but you weren’t aware of any issues connected with that?

Kern: No, not really.

Lowther: Okay, sexual promiscuity?

Kern: No, that was very definitely frowned on.

Lowther: Okay, homosexuality?

Kern: No, nothing like that.

Lowther: Voter responsibility?

Kern: I think that was something that - I - some of these questions I’m answering with my own bias because that to me is very important and I think that it was very important at that time.

Lowther: At that time, of course, students - you couldn’t vote until you were 21.

Kern: True.

Lowther: So probably not many students were really thinking of voting. You’ve already talked about military service.

Kern: Right.

Lowther: Were you aware of government welfare programs?

Kern: As in the past with the taking care of people - CCC’S and that sort of thing for the 30’s.

Lowther: Not in the ‘40’s?

Kern: Not in the ‘40’s.

Lowther: Violence? Violence on the street?

Kern: No, we had no campus police. We had nothing that was needed to be policed.

Lowther: Dieting, physical fitness?

Kern: That’s always with us. (laughs)

Lowther: The novelty. I don’t know how that got in there.

Kern: I know, I looked at that and wondered too.

Lowther: Okay, do you - the 1960’s, of course, was the decade of real activism on campus, but do you recall any thing similar in the 40’s when you were here? Any student activism? Nobody demonstrated?

Kern: We had some - I don’t know if I should name names or not but anyway we had some fellows that were really more active in trying to get people interested in these things and they had gone on - have gone on to be quite - one of them was a legislator and its just the kind of thing they like to do.

Lowther: Do you recall any of the issues that they might have been concerned about at the time?

Kern: No.

Lowther: Okay, and you said you didn’t have a campus police force?

Kern: Not that I recall.

Lowther: Probably didn’t need one.

Kern: We didn’t have very many policemen in the town either.

Lowther: Okay, any humorous events that you recall?

Kern: Let’s see if I can think of anything at that time. I do want to put something across because - Phil would bring up pies to Sue Lombard. You do know that we used to have lights out at 10:00 where the doors would close on the dorms at 10:00 and the boys, of course, had to be out and everything locked up and so occasionally why the fellows would bring pies to us and they would get them for 40 cents for a pie which was very good and we were very appreciative but the idea of 40 cents for a pie now when we pay seven or eight dollars is a little interesting.

Lowther: Well 40 cents then, what was the hourly wage? When you were thinning apples you were probably getting 25 cents an hour.

Kern: I started at 25 and went up to 35.

Lowther: I remember that.

Kern: You remember that too?

Lowther: I thinned apples too.

Kern: And then when you contracted you hoped you had a little more profit.

Lowther: Were there dorm mothers?

Kern: Yes, Mrs. Coffin, Mrs. Fannie Coffin and she was jut a very nice person. I think being a dorm mother was a hard job.

Lowther: Did the students interact very much with the townspeople?

Kern: Not a lot. They did, of course, when they went down to the Y. They would be downtown.

Lowther: There was a YMCA?

Kern: YMCA where the Eagles is now and that was open and active and you always knew who was in charge of it - USC.

Lowther: I suppose the Y did serve a lot of the servicemen?

Kern: Yes.

Lowther: Besides the cadets on campus, were there servicemen stationed in and around Ellensburg?

Kern: I don’t think so.

Lowther: Did some from Moses Lake or Ephrata air bases come into Ellensburg?

Kern: I don’t remember that either.

Lowther: You were going to say something?

Kern: I think I lost it.

Lowther: Okay, is there anything else you recall about the college that you would like to mention?

Kern: I was going to tell you also about Mrs. Coffin because the house mothers would come around or their assistant would come around and check to make sure no one was turning off the lights, you know, before 10:00 and it was kind of a fun thing for the fellows. They would turn out the lights just to give the house mothers a bad time. It didn’t take very much to amuse us at that time and, of course, everything would be locked at 10:00 and we would have meetings after the 10:00 curfew. Dorm meetings down in the?

Lowther: Okay-

Putnam: No, it’s not the time. I have a question.

Lowther: Oh, go ahead.

Putnam: Who was president while you were going to school?

Kern: United States president?

Putnam: No, the president of the college. Do you remember?

Kern: Oh, Dr. McConnell.

Putnam: Did you have any recollection of him?

Kern: Oh yes. We ? elections with Dr. McConnell and some might feel that he preferred to do everything his own way.

Lowther: Did you have the opinion that he was somewhat authoritarian?

Kern: Definitely. As far as I was concerned working in student government. We had to prove ourselves and I think I could be a little biased on that too because I felt very definitely that this was something we had to do.

Lowther: But did you sort of expect school administrators at that time to be authoritarian?

Kern: I don’t think I gave it any thought. I had such a good rapport with the rest of them and they were all friendly and helpful and he was friendly and helpful too but he didn’t want you to know.

Lowther: But there were limits?

Kern: I liked him and I liked Mrs. McConnell. It was just –

Lowther: Did you get invited to their home?

Kern: I was not invited often.

Putnam: Let me ask a couple others because of my interest in physical education.

What were the facilities at that time when you were majoring in physical education?

Where were the classes held?

Kern: Classes were held in the old - in what’s now the sub, you know, just in back of Sue. There was a tennis court in back of Sue where the dining hail is now. And then the pavilion was the building right in the back of it. We had - like facilities, what do you mean?

Putnam: Well, I meant the football field or any of the women’s sports like –

Kern: We shared the football field which was Tomlinson Field which is where Black is and Grupe Center and we had - it seems to me we had good facilities for showers and things like that.

Putnam: So you didn’t use any of the rooms here in Barge. They used to have a facility down on the first floor there.

Kern: They had moved out.

Putnam: They had moved out by then.

Lowther: The gym was in what is now the sub?

Putnam: Where the bookstore is now, I believe.

Kern: Yes.

Putnam: And you had mentioned Jesse Pucket who has since retired in Oregon now.

Kern: I saw her at the thing for Dr. Shaw and Dr. Smyser.

Putnam: So what were some of your professor’s names - some people that you took classes from in physical education? Jesse, what did she do?

Kern: Well mostly she was - she taught us sports. And the rest of the things, I can’t remember.

Putnam: Okay.

Kern: I just don’t remember.

Putnam: Do you have any other recollection of people, personalities?

Kern: I had Miss Horn. We had Dorothy Harrison.

Putnam: Now, Miss Horn, what was her first name?

Kern: Dorothy.

Putnam: Dorothy Horn.

Kern: She was Dorothy and then Dorothy Harrison. Jesse is the one that I really remember the most.

Putnam: Because she was?

Kern: She was the one that I had more classes from. She was the one that I knew best.

Putnam: What was the curriculum like? What classes did you have to take as a major?

Kern: I wish could tell you all these.

Putnam: Well, you took sports, that’s for sure.

Kern: I took sports and I had to take some theory

Putnam: I remember you said kinesiology and probably physiology and anatomy.

Kern: Yes, I did. I had all that. Of course, I had my physics and my chemistry. But I can’t remember as far as my actual –

Putnam: Did you have to student teach or go out and practice?

Kern: I did for two quarters and I taught P.E. under Dorothy Rizer as my supervisor which was then Morgan Junior High and I think I had to teach math. I can’t remember.

Putnam: But most of them taught - the student teaching was done here in town? They didn’t go –

Kern: They didn’t go - well traveling was hard too at that time. So if you were teaching hopefully you were here in town.

Putnam: Did you have uniforms?

Lowther: If traveling was hard, what schools did Central compete against. Who were their competitors?

Kern: Well, I looked at some of the - we competed against Western and I know

in ‘42 they competed against the Huskies.

Lowther: Football?

Kern: This was basketball. I wish I could remember the rest of them. I’m sorry.

Lowther: Anything else about the teacher training program? You mentioned student teaching but do you remember any of the other courses that you had to take?

Kern: I do. I remember them as being very boring. Everybody said? And, of course, Professor Stevens lightened everything up with his psychology class. He’d tease us.

Lowther: All right. Since graduating from college, you said that you did not pursue a career.

Kern: No.

Lowther: And became a housewife.

Kern: I became a housewife and a mother five times, five girls.

Lowther: Okay, that’s important.

Kern: My bin was very busy.

Lowther: Have you - since you graduated have you had contact with the alumni office?

Kern: Yes, I have.

Lowther: Are you a member?

Kern: Yes, I have had a lot of contact with Gail through the office here.

Lowther: Is there anything else you would like to talk about?

Kern: Well, let me check my notes here and see what else I didn’t tell you about. You were talking about sports. My husband is very sports minded, very interested in sports so he’s very aware of these fellows that used to play and they were very good friends. Most of those fellows were here between ‘41, ‘42, and ‘43. They’re involved with the Hall of Fame group so its - I should remember what they played because - who they played because we’ve heard a lot about it. And I didn’t talk about Dorothy Dean which I meant to. She was another good person at this school. 

Lowther: What was her position?

Kern: She taught physics, chemistry. She was the science dean. I also forgot to tell you I was a member of Kappa Delta Phi.

Lowther: Is that an honorary?

Kern: That’s the honorary group in education. I think that’s it.

Lowther: Do you look back on your Central time with fondness?

Kern: Yes, I do. In fact my two roommates and I got together last July and one lives in New Mexico and the other lives in New York State and we met in Seattle with some other friends and had a get together. There were small groups that kept together just to share memories and what are we doing now. I also wanted to tell you that my mother graduated from Central and I did and we had four of our daughters graduated from here.

Putnam: When did your mother graduate?

Kern: In ‘21. My - we have a granddaughter-in-law who graduated in June and three other grandchildren who go to school here.

Lowther: So Central is kind of a tradition.

Kern: Well, it’s become a tradition. There’s another one going to UW now.

Lowther: So you must have felt it gave you a good education.

Kern: It gave me a good education.

Lowther: How have you - since then, have you been aware of that education playing any important role in your life?

Kern: Not particularly. I think your education is just part of living and I think you just keep improving and adding to these various things. But when you make friends like this going through the yearbooks there are so many people there that you see now that are in town or that are back and forth on the campus. There are a lot of relationships that we have kept and have enjoyed.

Lowther: Have there been any reunions?

Kern: Yes, we had a 50th reunion which was very fun.

Lowther: It was a small class. Almost like a family.

Kern: Right.

Lowther: Okay, Jean, do you have any more questions?

Putnam: No, I think not.

Lowther: Okay, well, thank you very much Shirley. It’s been great.

Putnam: Very interesting.