CWU LIVING HISTORY PROJECT

LOUIS KOLLMEYER

INTERVIEWER: Odette Golden

TECHNICIAN: Bob Jones

Golden: Good afternoon you are viewing another chapter of Living History of Central Washington University sponsored by the Central Washington Retired Association. Today is Wednesday, January 21, 1998, and the time is 2:27PM. Our audio specialist today is Bob Jones, Professor Emeritus in Librarianship. I am Odette Golden, the interviewer, Department of Foreign Languages, and our guest today is Louis Kollmeyer, Professor Emeritus of Art, and Artist extraordinary.

Golden: Good afternoon. Lou.

Kollmeyer: Good afternoon.

Golden: Would you please start with a brief personal history of your life before you came to Central, your birth, home town, family, education, military, and so forth?

Kollmeyer: Yes, I was born in the Ozark area of Missouri and actually went to an elementary school, one room rural school in the country down there. And then to Southwest Missouri State College, now called a University, of course, as most of them are, received a B.S. Degree in Education, and a Teaching Degree, then completed my Master’s at the University of Iowa, and my Doctorate at the University of Oregon. Between those two advanced, however, I went to midshipman school, enlisted in the Navy, and at Northwestern University, and was commissioned at that time and then was ordered to the USS CARD, which is a CDE, an Escort Carrier. And I served on that for the entire War, except for a few months after it was over, when I was assigned to bases in this country. In between times, when I knew I was going into the Service, I took a job, I was teaching in, I guess I should back up a bit more because I taught before I enlisted in the Navy, I taught in Southwest Missouri, in a consolidated school called Mountain Grove, Missouri for two years. And while there I, after my first year there I went to the University of Iowa to do Graduate work and then they offered me an Assistantship. I was a full-time teaching Fellow at Iowa for a year. Following that I went to La Grande, Oregon on a similar job, it was in the public schools. I taught in the high school and supervised Art in the elementary program in the school system. Then knowing I was going to enlist with the Country at War, as we know, when was it? 1941, December, 7th, but I took a job that summer with the Union Pacific Railroad as locomotive firemen and I was earning more money at that, actually than I was teaching school, but that wasn’t a profession for me, but it was an interesting experience. I did that for the whole summer, and then enlisted in the Navy. And then I didn’t get back to the States until 1945, I mean other than coming in occasionally to the Atlantic Coast, but we worked on anti-aircraft, I mean anti-submarine warfare during the time. We used to go into Africa to French Morocco which was Casablanca to re-fuel and take on a few supplies. We could buy oranges and eggs. That was all we were allowed to buy over there. They were both good. The oranges were terrific. I was in it, I know it as well, probably better than I do Ellensburg, because we were in there nine different times. And it was really funny, the first time after leaving there, we saw the Humphrey Bogart movie of Casablanca, and it had a number of things that are similar to what you saw in the city, as much as we could because it was still, it had just been occupied by the Allies when we went in. Not spending too much time on that, we stayed in the Atlantic, North Atlantic, off the Azores, and back and forth, and finally just did anti-submarine work. It was interesting that in Churchill’s writings, he stated that the overcoming of submarines and that type of patrol was one of the main supports for winning the War in Europe. Which is quite true. Well, when the War in Germany ended, we were sent to the Pacific, and this is part of the... everything that could float basically was sent in to, was congregated there with the idea of the first stage in the invasion of Japan in which, of course, didn’t have to take place, fortunately. And I’ll have to tell one little story about going into Guam. We were into Guam and went in along with the Indianapolis, a Cruiser. They opened the submarine nets for us and we went there unescorted because previously we had depended on our destroyers for protection from sonar, we had sonar equipment as far as that goes, but we didn’t carry it on our own carrier, but the Indianapolis had went in, we were both in there, went in about noon, and left about midnight that same day, and it had just off-loaded the two atomic bombs on Tinian before coming into Guam, and of course, none of us at the time except a few personnel on the Indianapolis and at Tinian, knew that this was done. They had off-loaded them there. And on its second night out, the Indianapolis was sunk and lost, a great loss of life. About 300 more, I think it was, the initial detonations of the torpedoes, and more than that, I think a total of around, I can’t recall off-hand, 800 perhaps before they were ever discovered. They had gone towards the Philippines. But at any rate, then we came back to the States shortly after that, and then I was assigned to the Great Lakes Naval Station. Then after that the Assistant Communication’s Officer at an air base, Naval air base at Chincopeague, Virginia. But that’s enough of that. I went back to La Grande after that and then was there another four years during which time I was Chair of the Art Department at Eastern Oregon for two years, filling a leave for someone who was away. And from there I went to the University of Wisconsin System as Chairman of the Art Department at River Falls Branch of the University of Wisconsin. And then I did graduate work at Minnesota and, as I mentioned, transferred to Oregon to complete that. And after nine years at Wisconsin, is when I came to Central Washington University.

Golden: What year was that?

Kollmeyer: 1958. I was here; I was Division Chairman. Today they call them Vice-presidents, or Deans, or something else, presumably, I guess Deans. The Department of Fine-Applied Arts which had the Technical -Industrial Education and Art. After about a year or two, I think it was about a year, we added Music and Home Economics to that Division. And so, it was during that time that we were expanding a lot, hiring new faculty and looking for classroom space. The Art Department was strung out in this building from top to bottom basically. We had classes in temporary buildings where tennis courts were out here, you know where, I think one of the Science Buildings may be there now, but we did build a new building for the Fine Arts, finally and also Home Economics, and I chaired that Committee for the Fine Arts Building. And it’s still an excellent building. It has marvelous facilities.

Golden: (?Department...?)

Kollmeyer: Well, the Department, at one time, you know, we had twenty-three faculty in the Department. And I might say that we also had seven women in the Department. We tried to get a little better balance because we didn’t have as much before. And also, I might say, our Division was the one that employed the first black faculty member on campus and we have an interest in that.

Golden: Who was that?

Kollmeyer: Pearl Douce. In Home Economics.

Golden: Still in Ellensburg.

Kollmeyer: And she’s still here.

Golden Enriching the local scene.

Kollmeyer: Yeah, and...

Golden: She worked out very well.

Kollmeyer: Also, I believe, the first Japanese, which was Richard Doi, in the Art

Department. He was the first one we hired on campus, not because they were black or

Japanese, or anything else, but because they fit our requirements at that time, our needs.

I’ll let you ask some questions.

Golden: I was interested in your very forward looking desegregation, without intending it to be desegregation.

Kollmeyer: This is true.

Golden: Did your two additions, one black and one woman, did they find the community here...

Kollmeyer: Oh, we had more than one woman. You’re talking about Japanese.

Golden: Yeah, and black, too.

Kollmeyer: Yeah.

Golden: Did they find the community receptive to them?

Kollmeyer: Well, I think so. I think there was no big deal about this. I mean, they fit in beautifully with the faculty and were contributing faculty members, excellent.

Golden: Because I, as Chairman of Foreign Languages, tried to hire a black man because he was the best qualified, he was from the Caribbean, and was told that we were not ready, yet.

Kollmeyer: You’re kidding. I didn’t ask anyone.

Golden: We changed our minds about that and he changed his mind too, he got a better offer somewhere else, so we lost him. Well, that’s very interesting. What was your first academic assignment at Central?

Kollmeyer: Well, I came as Division Chairman.

Golden: Oh, you came, Uh huh.

Kollmeyer: And I came as a Full Professor and I left as a Full Professor. I guess I didn’t gain too much, did I then? But no, I was actually administrative, but even so, I taught like halftime, a little more some times.

Golden: What were the students like at that time?

Kollmeyer: The students were marvelous. We had...

Golden: Now, we’re talking about 1958 on.

Kollmeyer: Yes, uh huh.

Golden: Tell us about the students at that time.

Kollmeyer: I think the students, we had a great mix of students, the ones I had were, I felt, were qualified, certainly, to come into College. They were conscientious, hard-working students and I always enjoyed teaching a lot. I feel, a little bit later, speaking of students, in the, I came back to teach twice after I retired, and even before that, I can work with elementary teachers in the courses I taught for Art for the elementary schools, see. But I also had Art majors and people in, I taught Renaissance Art History, etc. And I felt the students were gradually, a higher caliber, higher quality, a little bit, in terms of academic ability, perhaps. But even so, I found that some of them were lacking in writing skills. I felt that they were not careful enough. They were a little bit surprised when I required substantial term papers in, even in the course, the Humanities course, Art 101, whatever we taught, you see, In fact that course, and in my Renaissance, Art History Classes, but I helped them on how to do term papers, something on their English, their spelling, and whatever. I didn’t grade them down too much on that, but quite frankly I felt that they did not have quite the preparation in writing skills that I would have expected. And some of these were juniors and seniors still, see, that we had.

Golden: Did you know whether or not they had had experience writing research term papers before you required that?

Kollmeyer: they didn’t have as much experience as I was expecting, correct.

Golden: Very interesting.

Kollmeyer: I might mention, I don’t know where you’re moving here, but I do have some concerns about our curriculum and our offerings. I think it’s marvelous that we have schools and that we are stressing multi-faceted objectives in our University, but I feel that we should be cautious of, to protect the Humanities in the education of, in all of our programs for young people. I think this is extremely important. Sciences, I’ve always been on campuses where we’ve supported a full range of offerings and we stressed the Humanities along with the all other specialized fields.

Golden: Literature, in particular?

Kollmeyer: Where? Literature, the Arts, music, art, some background in that, and certainly Philosophy, along with some knowledge of foreign countries. It was interesting that the Wisconsin school where I was, that was stressed because we know so little, we hear about the problems of foreign countries, but we really, often times, are not told much about their great contributions, and I’m speaking here of under-developed countries. They’ve made great contributions in, like in the Arts, to the culture and perhaps in medicine, and languages...

Golden: Could you...

Kollmeyer: . . .And scientific research, etc. It’s great that I think that we are orienting our students here to more of this.

Golden: I was wondering if you could, I’ve never heard this from anyone I’ve interviewed and that’s very interesting, and significant. It needs to be publicized. Could you give us some specific examples of contributions to your particular academic area from under-developed countries in Art, for example?

Kollmeyer: Well, now there’s a tremendous background of expressive arts in the sculptural fields, say in Africa which varies from one part of Africa to the other. Certainly in Southeast Asia, so I guess those are some that I have in mind. I think that even in our own American continent here, we had some courses in Art of Middle America. And I had fortunately studied with a person who did a lot of research there, and discovered some of the murals, and they were really carved like, almost like a petroglyph, who had come from that area. We don’t really, I think our American Indians culture is important as well in the Northwest here, the Coast. We’re beginning to learn more and more about this, but it was overlooked for a longtime. They’ve brushed off a course that we had, and are beginning to teach it again in the Art Department. For awhile they did not teach these courses. African and Oceanic Art, for instance. And the Art of the Americas, and I think it’s important for people to know that.

Golden: Did you find interest in these third world countries, if you want to call it that, developing countries, from students whose background was racially from any of those countries here?

Kollmeyer: Well, we didn’t have too many of those here in those days, It’s true.

Golden: In contrast to...?

Kollmeyer: Present day, I think...

Golden: Yes.

Kollmeyer: . . . There are some exchange programs that are good in that respect.

Golden: Which. ..Could you tell us some of the under-developed, or developing countries, whatever you want to call it, who have sent students here, has that number increased with time?

Kollmeyer: I’m not as familiar with that, No, we did have a marvelous graduate student from the Caribbean Area down here, we had two or three of those, and who did their theses here, one in painting, particularly I remember, and he had had a European Education before he came here, and then he went on, I recommended him to head of the Art Department I knew at the University of Indiana. He went there to do his Doctorate Degree. His name was James Boodoo.

Golden: Where was he from exactly, do you remember?

Kollmeyer: I believe it was, I think it was Jamaica, I believe is where he came from. We had, I employed a teacher here from The Philippines, who was exceptionally well qualified. He had his Doctorate in Art History from Harvard. And again, a person I knew, who’s Dr. Arneson, he used to be Head of the School of Art with the University of Minnesota made a recommendation on him. This is the way I would work when I was trying to hire faculty. I would go to people I knew whom I could depend upon, and ask them for their recommendations and information on these people. But he was here for only, he was here for just a year, and I, that’s when I went out of the Chairmanship of the Art Department. And the Department didn’t keep him, even though he was told he could be here a second year when he first came in. He had to go back to the Philippines to meet an obligation for a short time, but he didn’t return here. I think those things, if you really have highly qualified faculty from other countries, this is one of the best ways of orienting students with those cultures.

Golden: American students.

Kollmeyer: Yes, our own students.

Golden: Exactly, yes.

Kollmeyer: Faculty change, kind of thing, too, is good for that.

Golden: I certainly agree with that being in Foreign Languages. I was recalling when I first came here I had students who not only were interested in learning French, they got interested after a while, some of them had never been as far West as the Pacific Ocean. That’s a hundred and ten miles, that’s not very far. So there was ample chance for broadening those horizons, too. Did you ever teach in any other Departments, or did they keep you pretty busy in your own?

Kollmeyer: No, I didn’t. Well, I’ll take that back. I did some co-teaching, as it were,

with Jane Jones one time in Music, Music Education, but I didn’t work in that

Department other than..., and of course, I had a close relationship with the Education

Department because I taught a course that we gave on Art for exceptional children. And

I worked closely with them, the people on that course.

Golden: Do you recall the names of any of the people in Education with whom you worked at that time, in the field of exceptional children?

Kollmeyer: Oh, let’s see. What’s the guy’s name who was head of that for quite a

while? They had two or three different people who worked with it as I recall, and I

should remember him.

Golden: Well, it will probably come to you later. In general, how would you say that

Education courses stacked up against other academic, those of other academic areas, at

Central?

Kollmeyer: I knew Central has had some exceptionally fine people in the field of

Education. I think of like Ham Howard, back when, he was in Education. I think, wasn’t

Maury Pettit in that field, as well?

Golden: Yes. I was thinking of Mabel Anderson.

Kollmeyer: I didn’t know her too well when she was here.

Golden: Oh.

Kollmeyer: I think Central has long had an excellent program of Teacher Education.

Golden: That’s how we started.

Kollmeyer: Right. We require people have an academic major. Elementary teachers were required, if they didn’t have a specific major, were required to have three academic minors then. And they could build those into a major if they’d like. They were like a thirty credit minor. And this is a good support I think, for teaching. And I’m all in favor of good programs for public school teaching, high school as well as, certainly elementary.

Golden: I wish we weren’t so limited on time because this is a subject that’s close to my heart, obviously, too. Well, our next question has to do with something not quite so pleasant, what problems do you recall, that you would class as significant, during your tenure at Central? I don’t think that means personal problems, at all,

Kollmeyer: Well, I think we had a continuous struggle for funding, and one that bothered me some were “caps” in enrollments, that the State placed on us. And what happened then was, it tended to give us kind of an elitism. Students were chosen on GPA, higher GPA, and my own feeling is that many capable students could be deprived of an education if we didn’t give them that opportunity because I found that a lot of them who didn’t have the highest grades when they came in were extremely successful and could go out and do fine things.

Golden: Perhaps they had not been challenged.

Kollmeyer: They hadn’t been challenged, and I think a lot of that, I think the young men often didn’t take their high school too seriously until about the senior year. Felt they, well, I better get some grades so I can get out of here, see. And where the young ladies who matured a little earlier, normally and they were probably more skillful in getting grades as well, and that is not to say that they weren’t capable because they were, we’ve had some tremendous students here, I think in both men and women, but I do feel that the GPA is one criteria, but shouldn’t be the only one.

Golden: That’s right. That’s a very good point, and I want to thank you for putting that on record. I agree with that. If you hang so much on the size of the high school they came from and the funding, that’s always with us, budgetary things. Number eight inquires, which administrators and faculty come to mind as important leaders while you were teaching here?

Kollmeyer: Well, I think Dr. Crum was a marvelous...

Golden: J. Wesley Crum.

Kollmeyer: Wesley Crum, was a marvelous Dean of Faculty and, was that his title? I think it was.

Golden: I thought he was in Education, Dean of Education.

Kollmeyer: He was Dean of Faculty, and Dr. Pettit was a fine administrator to work with and I enjoyed him a lot. He was basically Head of the Education I do believe. And of course Dr. Brooks I thought was a fine President. He became an excellent President. He was not too experienced initially here, but then, you could talk with him and he would listen, and he considered problems. In the Business, I guess, I enjoyed Ken Courson a lot. He was terrific.

Golden: What was your connection with Mr. Courson?

Kollmeyer: Well, I worked with him on budgets, and one time, I remember, I found a mistake of $10,000.00, that he had given us too much in the Art budget, a mistake. I told him about it, and said, “Well, Ken, we could keep quiet about this and split it, but I know we wouldn’t want to do that. Should let you know about it.” And he thanked me.

Golden: Do you feel he might have caught it by himself?

Kollmeyer: He could have, Oh, yeah, he probably did, but

Golden: The auditors would have caught it.

Kollmeyer: I actually, when I went to under-graduate college, I had, I worked my way through school, and so I went summers and winters. So I wound up with three majors. I had one in Fine Art, and one in Social Sciences, and one in Business. So I knew what a balance sheet looked like and I was able to work budgets, which was a big help, but we did have a problem on funding, and I don’t know of too many others. I think the method of employing faculty is pretty cumbersome, the way we do it today.

Golden: Can you explain that a little bit?

Kollmeyer: Well, you send out the prospectus to faculty all over the world, I mean this country, many places, and I think there is some value in that, but on the other hand,

Golden: A job description, you mean.

Kollmeyer: Yes.

Golden: Of the position available, yes.

Kollmeyer: Yes, description. It’s very time consuming and, but what I was able to do for most of the time I worked in administration here, was to contact Universities I knew and would also work with faculty as to places from where they had come for suggestions of contacting Departments and so on, these Universities. And then we would do this and once we got the material, three or four people, we didn’t have hundreds of them, see. We would look over these and then have interviews, and make a decision which was somewhat more streamlined, but we also knew the people who were recommending them. And this made some difference. I remember calling, writing to, and I called him too, Mr. Mauricio Lasanski, who was a great print maker at the University of Iowa. And I had gotten acquainted with him when I was there, and I said, “We need a print maker.” I said,” Send me information on your three best people.” And he said, “I’ll just send you one. That’s all you need.” And that was Margaret Ahrens who later became Margaret Sahlstrand. And she was an excellent print maker and a fine teacher, since retired.

Golden: Even though she was a woman.

Kollmeyer: That’s not.. .(Laughter) Her prints were strong. You would not assume that they were... I remember she gave me a print of hers, a self portrait. Marvelous, full standing figure, and I still have it. A great etching, black and white, of course. But she was a delightful person, and is.

Golden: Do you have any memories of problems existing between the teaching faculty and the administration?

Kollmeyer: No, not particularly, no. I think there may have been some, nothing unusual. And there’s another one down here relative to the “Town and Gown” business, I think that is almost like a Tempest in a Teapot...

Golden: I think so, too.

Kollmeyer sort of thing. Or students and administration is on that question.

Golden: Most students tell me they have no contact with the administration, and want to know, “What does the President look like?”

Kollmeyer: Is that right?

Golden: They haven’t said that recently because . . .I haven’t asked recently.

Kollmeyer: That could be true today, more so than ever.

Golden: That’s too bad.

Kollmeyer: I used to enjoy meeting and talking to students when I was chairman of the Division, and made a practice of getting around and visiting with them because if you had a good relationship with students, you could learn a lot about what they were getting and their thinking about their programs here, and so on.

Golden: I think President Brooks tried to do that, and he was young, too.

Kollmeyer: He was good on that, excellent.

Golden: Does he remind you of anyone on the current National scene?

Kollmeyer: President Brooks?

Golden: Uhm hum.

Kollmeyer: Ah, well, who would I say? Not President Clinton?

Golden: No.

Kollmeyer: I don’t know. He reminded me a little bit of a President I worked with in Wisconsin, who was Dr. Kleinpel, I think the best President I ever worked with. And he, I have to tell you a funny story about him, although I have a story I can tell you about Dr. Brooks, not about him, but... We had, there was a show in, an Art Show at the Larson Gallery in Yakima and it was open to, it was an Art, it was the Central Washington Art Exhibit they held each year. And our graduate students sometimes would submit work to it, and they are qualified to do that with independent work, and certainly some faculty. Well, there were a few paintings, two or three perhaps, and I don’t know how many that had some nude figures in them, see. Well, now we didn’t sponsor that show, but, and people did submit work. And we had a rather conservative Board member, I can’t recall his name, I didn’t know him, but had written a letter in the Yakima paper, lambasting this show and saying if that was the kind of thing Central taught, they’d have to look into it. Well, I happened to see the letter and I told Dr. Brooks, I said, “We better answer that.” And he said, “Well, yeah, Why don’t you write something down for me.” So I wrote a letter for him and I pointed out that we had similar problems, there used to be some objection to nude figures in the Sistine Chapel. One of the Popes had this, painted over part of the.. .but historically there were figures, the figure was used a great deal in painting, this was nothing new, and it was kind of an interesting letter. He said, “I like that; I’ll sign it.” And he sent it to the person. They never said any more about it. But one painting, I think they had an objection to, there was a lady riding a pig around a circle of some sort. And I don’t think it was a take-off on Hieronymous Bosch, but it might have been. And what statement she was trying to make, I have no idea. I said, “We have no responsibility for this, but we certainly support people’s right to submit these things and they also went through a jury.” But we heard nothing more about it.

Golden: Just as well, probably. I might have, wrote a few letters that did not have any fall out either. Well, let’s see, do you want to talk about the salary schedule, Dr. Kollmeyer?

Kollmeyer: I think salaries were always pretty low in the early years, I don’t know what they are now, but I thought they were lower than our comparable universities in some cases.

Golden: That was the AAUP finding, too. How about ..., do you have any feeling about the Faculty Code? Academic Freedom?

Kollmeyer: Well, no. Academic Freedom, I felt, personally, absolutely no restriction on that, and I felt very good about our, those items here.

Golden: Of course you just really, mentioned an exception to that in the objection to the nude figures.

Kollmeyer: Oh, that had nothing to do with the Institution here, that was a particular board member...

Golden: No...

Kollmeyer: . . . Who objected.

Golden: Well, but the Board member had something to do with...

Kollmeyer: He could have had, but he didn’t pursue it, obviously.

Golden: No. Maybe his wife had a sensitivity, I don’t, in “D” here, it says here in

collegiality, I don’t like to ask that question because I have no idea what it means.

Kollmeyer: Which one is that?

Golden: It is 11 -“D”. Faculty-Administration. I don’t know what “Collegiality” means. I think it’s one of these new...

Kollmeyer: Collegiality.

Golden: Yes.

Kollmeyer: Oh, well, I think that varies a little. I thought there was a very friendly faculty here, but

Golden: Atmosphere?

Kollmeyer: Yes., among faculty. I didn’t feel it was quite as congenial initially as what I’d been accustomed to back in Wisconsin. But maybe we had longer winters there.

Golden: Yes, it’s snowing quite heavily at the moment, though, perhaps we will equal Wisconsin. “G”, on your next question. Long range planning, that’s always been a sore subject here, I think. Page 2...

Kollmeyer: My feeling on that is that initially when I became acquainted with this here, was that it was not long reaching enough. I know that part of my work at the University of Oregon, one of my majors in fact was on organization of institutions and curriculum, of course, but administrative organization, and I suggested to Dr. Brooks at the time, some years before we went into schools, that we should go to schools, of course, I supported strongly the idea of the University name, partly because of funding that you seem to get more easily. But I suggested five, to possibly six schools, sometime before they went to schools here, and also I think the long range planning in terms of program offerings and campus building, etc., took a while to concentrate into a good direction here. I had worked on long range planning for the University of Wisconsin when I was

there, so I had some experience with it, and they had done a pretty good job here I think, ultimately, with it. It was excellent. We did a School of Economics here, for instance, we needed that, as far as curriculum (?is/was) concerned.

Golden: There is a note here about faculty organizations, including unions, which has become an increasingly important subject. I was going to say a sore subject...

Kollmeyer: I think unions can sometimes be divisive, but I do believe that a good faculty organization is excellent. And I think faculty should be, feel free to work with administration, with the President, and be considered, their suggestions, certainly by the Board of Trustees, and because after all, I think the University is strong or weak based on the quality of its faculty and the relationship of their attitude toward the administrative structure and administrative support. So I think that is an item, aside from the union. I think the union in some places is probably a means of reaching an accommodation and support for their ideas on a faculty. I think it should, if they do have this, it should expand to more than just the salary situation.

Golden: And teacher load, yes.

Kollmeyer: So, but that seems to get the attention more than other things, from a union standpoint. But there are others like, benefits, I think it’s a shame in this state that, say Community Colleges, for instance, hire so many people who are adjunct faculty, so that they can avoid having health benefits, retirement benefits, etc., and also can hire them for less income than they would have to pay to regular faculty because I’m a strong believer in a good Community College system. Many students can attend there, when they can’t afford to go to our four year schools and graduate schools. And I think we have a real problem, there may be some administrative, I think, maybe a too high a percentage of people on campus in administration, perhaps. That’s probably only one of the reasons that the cost of education has skyrocketed. Not as much here as it has some places, perhaps, but at a higher, faster rate than the inflation by quite a lot. I think that’s bad, and something should be done. There’s been a national study on that, I’m not sure that they’ve accomplished much but, except to point it out. But I believe this is something that needs attention in higher education. Fortunately, the administration is doing something on a national scale to get some support for student loans, make it easier, that kind of thing.

Golden: Do you feel that there should be some avenue for the faculty to have direct contact with the Board of Trustees?

Kollmeyer: Well, I think they do that through the Senate, I believe to some extent. I personally don’t feel the faculty should, probably do too much in going directly to the Board. I believe that, I’ve always kind of believed in a chain of command to some extent. I think you should go through your administrative personnel, and through the committees set up on campus for that purpose, be it a Graduate Committee, Faculty Senate, and so on, because I’ve served on a number of those committees. I was on the President’s Council, was on the Graduate Committee for a period of time, the Senate for a couple of terms, I think, and the Teacher Ed. Committee, I’ve forgotten others, and they can be, we were together on committees, if you remember.

Golden: Yes

Kollmeyer: . . . and I believe that through recommendations of committees, you can get information to the Board through your, via the Deans, etc., on campus, and I think that’s the way it should be.

Golden: I think this interview...

Kollmeyer: How’re we doing on time?

Golden: . . .Could delightfully continue for another hour, but we are down to six more minutes. You know so much about education in general, I hate to cut us off like this, Dr. Kollmeyer. There are some personal questions here about, number 19, were you married before you came to Central? I don’t know if you want to discuss it.

Kollmeyer: Well, that’s not on my copy. Yes, I was, and still am.

Golden: To the same person.

Kollmeyer To the same person. Right.

Golden: Did you, did your spouse, Where did your spouse get his, or her, education.

Kollmeyer: Oh, Faye went to, she took some work at the University of Iowa, and usually some courses, wherever I was teaching as well, and then she finally did her work in real estate through the State of Washington here. And got her licenses, a broker and whatever, a graduate realtor. Had her own...

Golden: And was very, very successful.

Kollmeyer: Had her own business here for fourteen years. Heartland Realty. She knows, perhaps, more faculty and townspeople than I do. Even though...

Golden: Well, it’s part of her business.

Kollmeyer: But she retired a few years ago now.

Golden: We’ve been talking mostly about teaching here, but in the time that’s left, I would like you, please, to discuss something that I don’t know very much about, and that is the part of your life that regards your art. Would you talk to us about that?

Kollmeyer: OK, yeah. Well, I’ve always engaged in, sort of, creative activities, you might say. I’m a painter, and have worked in the field of sculpture as well. In design I, at one time I thought I might concentrate in industrial design, but decided to take painting instead.

Golden: Industrial design of buildings?

Kollmeyer: Three dimensional design. Industrial design is like designing machinery or chair, whatever, see. But I have designed a few houses. Two at Lake Chelan that we built there.

Golden: And your studio.

Kollmeyer: And my studio, of course.

Golden: Beautiful studio here.

Kollmeyer: But as far as, I’ve painted more, probably more on a regular basis since I retired, but I always did paint, and exhibit work, I thought it was important, but not just because of what I was doing, but because I felt the urge to paint. And I have done a whole series of things quite recently on the Indian Petroglyphs in the Columbia Basin. Not Columbia Basin, but the Mid-Columbia Area. Here and some farther down.

Golden: I saw them in the Gallery.

Kollmeyer: Last year I did a book. Which is at a potential publisher right now, and I need to hear from him pretty soon, I suppose. But that is.. .the Petroglyph paintings will be one chapter in that. And I would have about one hundred and twenty, I think, paintings reproduced in it. And In that I give a little biographical information, of course, but mainly I talk about the paintings themselves, and something I would do with design, the technique used, etc. I have one chapter in it, for instance, on travel, travel inspired because like in 1996, J guess it was, we spent a month in Italy and France combined and, but two weeks solidly up in the Tuscany Hills. We stayed in an inn out of Sarteano which was a little village that had a very interesting background, as all of them do there. Pienza and Cetona, and, of course, some time in Florence and some time in Rome, some in Sienna.

Golden: Do you speak Italian?

Kollmeyer: No, but I understand quite a little of it because I, from my Renaissance Art study, and then, of course, I’m old enough to have taken Latin in high school, and I took Spanish in high school, but not French. We had no problem getting along. And in France we were in Aries for a short time and then we drove on to Carcassonne and then up to the Dordogne River Valley that has more of the Cro-Magnon Paintings in caves than anywhere else in France.

Golden: Those are closed now to the public.

Kollmeyer: Yes.

Golden: Because of pollution.

Kollmeyer: And we’ve been to England a number of times, so I, that chapter in the book has some paintings, partly based on travel, and then there were others like the rivers, canyons, another on prairie, and desert lands and sky, and that kind of thing. One on winter themes, but I keep active in painting to answer your question there.

Golden: Do you, if you had to rank teaching art and producing it yourself, which one would be number one?

Kollmeyer: Boy, I’m torn there. I consider myself to have been a teacher basically who is also an artist, but I’ve also worked in art, and I mean always worked in art.

Golden: So they’re inseparable.

Kollmeyer: Pretty much, inseparable.

Golden: Dr. Kollmeyer, we want to thank you. This is one of the most interesting interviews I have conducted.

Kollmeyer: Oh, thank you, very much.

Golden: I feel I’ve met someone I didn’t really know all these years, when I thought I did really know you. Thank you so much.

Kollmeyer: All right. There are so many things we could have covered, right.